We should only watch the real old trek.
I mean, it was one of the first shows ever to:
- have a woman in a command position,
- depict a black person in a non-servile role,
- show Russians and Americans working as a team during the Cold War, and
- have an Asian character portrayed by an actual Asian actor,
but it wasn’t woke!
MLK Jr himself called Nichelle Nichols to encourage her to play Uhura. First interracial kiss on scripted television. She worked with NASA after Trek to encourage and recruit black and female astronauts.
Which sounds wholesome (and I don’t say it’s not at all) until you realize Nichols wanted to do something else, I think it was musicals, and King convinced her by saying “we need you to have representation. When you’re gone, anyone can take that position, even an alien” and so she stayed instead of self realization.
Boo hoo? Certainly, worse things happened to her in her life.
That is pretty sad, but I think she and he were both right to respect the impact she had by staying in the role.
The most iconic science fiction crew of all time will forever include a prominent impressive black woman. Nichelle made that happen, through her performances.
First interracial kiss on scripted television.
That’s a common myth. There were several others before, some of which also had Shatner as one half of the kissing pair, believe it or not. Trek’s was definitely more high-profile, though, and with several of the others it may have been hard to notice with that particular combination with the quality of televisions at the time; European man with Asian woman probably wasn’t noticeable on a tiny '50s black and white TV.
Have a Japanese character about 20 years after ww2.
Have a Russian character during the Cold War.
It’s all Old Trek that came before the J.J. Abrams movie reboot.
but it wasn’t woke!
Define woke then, please.
Define woke then, please.
do you kids today really need /s behind every s?
You have no idea how many wild claims my autistic ass has seen that were absolutely serious.
were they, or did you just assume so?
Do you really want to say they weren’t? Do you really want to deny my experiences?
Edit: don’t bother answering, I’m blocking you. I don’t like people referring to middle aged people as ‘kids’ and I don’t like people doubting others’ experiences without any knowledge about said experiences.
Do you really want to deny my experiences?
i do. you just did not recognize pretty clear sarcasm, it is documented in writing above. it is unlikely that it was only time in your life it happened. so yeah, some of these experiences in your past were also cases where you did misread the situation.
your badly acted offense does not change anything about that.
All those were token characters regularly repeating stereotypes about said groups, but OK.
Showing people from different sides of the curtain working together in future was kinda normal for science fiction.
The whole PR representation of the Cold War was like “friendly competition” or “hostile agreement” or a schism of the same religion. A good faith disagreement. USSR in some sense pretended to be like USA, but a better one, to bring the next stage of humanity’s development. You know all those failed\cancelled continuations, Half-Life 3, KotOR 3, Perl 6, FreeBSD 5 (ok, that transpired and didn’t kill FreeBSD completely, but), Gnome 3, KDE 4, Star Wars after 2005 and till being bought by Disney. Or ambitious alternative projects that went nowhere.
At the same time there were various levels of propaganda on either side, at the bottom for one it was the free world about to nuke dem damn commies, for the other it was the civilized peaceful humanity about to squash decadent anglosaxon zionists. But note how both variants imply there is good in the other side, just suppressed because they are possessed by evil.
So - not so strange. People perceive that friendliness as something new and the current hostility as something old, sometimes that’s not true. In some sense our time is more chauvinist than 60s and 70s, not less.
That argument is indeed stupid, but Kurtzman Trek is inferior in every other way.
- the plots are often incoherent
- the tone strays too far from what made classic Star Trek compelling
- the overuse of action and spectacle comes at the expense of thoughtful Sci fi
- Character development feels shallow to nonexistent
- and so much more
Everything is just bad.
That’s my impression from DIS, but isn’t SNW supposed to be decent?
Nope.
I tried a few episodes because someone said they’d done a great space battle. The battle was 8/10, but every thing else was just dumb.
SNW is decent. S2 E2 is an especially strong episode.
snw was too robotic, seems like the actors were being forced to say those lines every scene. they had good premise but the execution was poor, as the other 2 series. picard was equally cringey as std, again they had so MUCH history they can use for the show, but it ended falling flat, and they were using source material from fan novels. (the friendly borg, the rogue changelings,etx) all came from various novels.
prodigy and lower decks were much better shows than the 3 though. too bad t hey got cancelled too fast.
If he’s the one behind “Strange New Worlds” I have to agree. Watched about three episodes and gave up.
Team lands on a strange object with the power to move a planet. “Hey, let me grab this thing!”
SNW was just too much like the other 2. had a big bad romulans at the end of season 1, but they dint do anything with them the next season, just completely disappeared.
What I’d like to see is a complete reboot. No humanoid aliens with five fingers; only nightmare creatures. Erase all prior canon. Start with an Earth based starship with a crew of five hundred humans. And get some real scientists to come up with plots.
enterprise wouldve gone on longer if les moonves dint trash the show. that wouldve been a good start.
To be fair, the Romulans only showed up because this was an alternate timeline version of a TOS episode.
dint kurtzman do the transformer series? i dont know why he was chose for this. almost end of every season, was universing ending event, the exact same plot as the previous season, and then they drop it the next seasons. remember the horrible klingon look, and thier cloaking, people had so much issues they partially dropped it on the 2nd season, and "Escaped to the 31st " century.
Idk, I think Discovery just sucks.
Strange New Worlds and Lower Decks kick ass, though.
Edit: Discovery and Picard. Picard sucks ass, too. I just cannot force myself further than episode two.
I think the difference is because Disco and Picard are serialized while SNW and LD are episodic.
On serialized Trek, if the writers get a bug up their asses to do a mirror universe storyline or a section 31 storyline, you’re stuck with that tedious bullshit for at least half a season. If episodic Trek has a stinkburger episode that everyone mocks for decades (Sub Rosa), the next week can give you a premise so beloved that they base a whole series on it (Lower Decks).
Episodic Trek can take more risks. I kinda miss the longer seasons for the same reason.
Yes, upon rewatching TNG, I realized that I might actually like less than half of the stories that much, but that still leaves so many stories I do like.
If I was inclined to like a discovery story to start with, it will wear out its welcome pretty soon because they drag it out so long.
That’s fair.
Try Picard season three though, that was way better than seasons 1&2. :-)
I liked the first few minutes of Picard but nothing after.
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Meh, there were a few times where the comedy could have probably taken more of a backseat than it did, but the comedy didn’t overall bother me that much. I did like that it was a more unpolished take on what life in Starfleet is like, and the comedy was the vehicle that that view was delivered through. I mean, take Shax and T’ana making it super uncomfortable to be roomed close to the holodecks; realistically, who isn’t going to get up to some freaky shit with tech like that? The live action shows kinda dance around it, but I like that Lower Decks was able to address it outright because it’s allowed to take itself less seriously.
Strange New World and Prodigy are really nice shows though and I can see some old trek fans being very entertained by Lower Decks (including me).
I love all three and I am so glad they came along after DIS, effectively saving the franchise IMO
Old Trek fan here. Love the crap out of SNW and Lower Decks!
This.
TNG is “Old Trek” now. Thanks for ruining my day at 6:49am.
Everything before the 2009 movie reboot is old trek, including Enterprise despite it’s last episode airing only four years before JJ Abrams’ movies were released.
JJ Abrams’ movies were released.
Ha ha what are you talking about that’s not a thing that ever happened ha ha ha
Wdym? Star Trek 2009 was an okay movie and Beyond was actually fine. Also I can absolutely recommend Strange New World and Prodigy. Lower Decks can also be fun if you’re into fan service.
I wish I could like DIS, but every season I’ve been disappointed in the plot points and character writing. It could’ve been so good
Saru is the high point of that show. He’s the only character I was able to like unconditionally. He should have remained captain!
it was michelle yeoh, she was stealing too much of the other actors spotlight(they dont seem like they could act) and she had to leave the show. saru was a close second though. it was wierd how they forced michael, yes its name of the woman that the showrunner forced into the show.
Let’s be happy then that there’s more new trek than just disco.
Orville is more Roddenberrian than nutrek will ever be.
That’s selling Lower Decks a bit short. Yes, it has a big focus on comedy, but it has some genuinely great pathos that’s up there with the best of Trek.
“In the past, Klingons believed humans to be weak and easily defeated. But your species has proved its toDuj. Sito was a warrior. You do not honor her.”
“You didn’t know her!”
“Do you follow every order from your commanders?”
“No!”
“Sito made her choice. You want to solve puzzles and mysteries? Your friend gave her life to protect that. [scoffs] She would not approve of your actions.”
Honestly, it was long before that when I tuned out zombie Star Trek forever.
I’ll fucking say. I had to re-read the thing three times to figure out what the hell they were talking about, saying “Old Trek” over a shot of TNG.
No shit. I was reading as I was scrolling and I read “Old Trek” and saw Data and it didn’t make sense. It’s literally called “The Next Generation” because it was new after TOS.
nutrek is consideredin jj-abrams-present.
old trek before “enterprise” the series.
Yeah, anyone who complains that Trek is suddenly all woke and political now never watched any classic Star Trek or hasn’t been paying attention back then.
I’ve watched all of Star Trek on the big screens and the small ones at least once - including Section 31 - and it’s as political as it has ever been. And there has always been brilliance and absolute dogshit. Those who say NuTrek is all shite don’t know what they’re talking about.
Nice username btw.
Thanks.
they called STARGATE WOKE too, of all the scifi shows, they try to call a show that did use as much accuracy as possible to the USAF in the early years. additionally this was also discussed on one of cringey ml, hexbear posts for some reason, they are framing it as WOKE. they think its increasing propaganda because its based on USAF/CANADA/russian(to an extent).
I agree “old” Trek was woke too. It just blended in better imo. (Especially with Disco, it felt like there was a metaphorical spotlight on the “woke”.)
old trek had more subtlty, nutrek was too forced and out in the open to the point, it was distracting from the series plots. and std and picard were not very good shows. SNW need better actors/acting though, although they have much better arcs than the last 2.
I’m still irritated about that scene on behalf of Nimoy. Shatner should have been told to stuff his ego up his ass.
What went wrong with that scene?
The kiss between Kirk and Uhurah was supposed to be between Uhurah and Spock. Shatner threw a fit and got the script changed. He essentially stole Spock’s girlfriend because he wanted all the romance scenes.
“Spock’s girlfriend?” That’s not TOS canon, in any way.
Correct, because Shatner threw a fit.
What happened?
The kiss between Kirk and Uhurah was supposed to be between Uhurah and Spock. Shatner threw a fit and got the script changed. He essentially stole Spock’s girlfriend because he wanted all the romance scenes.
Shatner certainly caused problems, but one scene, one kiss, out of the whole of ToS, hardly seems like it would have established a relationship with Uhurah. 🤷♂️
Honestly just miss everyone working together. I only did about 1.5 seasons each of Picard and Discovery, but I just couldn’t take all the “the enemy is each other”. If I wanted that I’d watch the expanse? Ftr I will watch them in entirety and fully judge at that point, rn I haven’t so can’t say they offer nothing. SNW seems to get it though which I appreciate and hope continues. There are so few optimistic sci-fi shows I really want trek to stick to that niche.
Hm and here I thought new trek was bad because of weak and lazy story writing, including blatant inconsistencies with old trek and ‘burning’ the original cannon in order to avoid being accountable to it. 🤔
What was that show that had the first recognized interracial kiss? Way back in November 22 1968 … honestly, if Star Trek had done that it would have been considered shocking and “woke”.
Star Trek has ALWAYS been controversial.
not only that, interracial crew, a Japanese, russian and a black woman on the main crew!!!
I hate posts about some vocal asshat complaining about something being woke. Anybody who uses the word woke derogatory is an asshole who doesn’t deserve a moment of my attention.
STD and picard is pretty much the reason why they start calling it woke, they dint care of the plot/and the series were crappy, just that the showrunners try to overemphasize certain characthers that they are not white, and straight and men. also the problem with STD, was naming an unlikable characther/actor as the lead role and to captain with a name that is only assigned to one gender, they were hoping this is a distraction for a poor series/writing overall. an analagous media, is J lawrence being a goodie two shoes, mary sue about her importance.
“And look what happened to Lol. She fucking died!”
They made because they’re not awake.
The problem is that when people say “New Trek”, they actually mean Discovery.
Discovery is a poorly written show made by people who do not grok Trek, and think that high ranking naval officers behaving like teenagers makes for good TV. SNW is alsio Nu Trek and manages to be faithful to the original vision while introducing new concepts.
Calling people critical of poory written shows bigots is very discrespectful. You may like it, but that doesn’t mean that everybody else has to like it as well.
