I swear, every time most of the time I see someone being particularly rude, ignorant, and inappropriate on a post (usually political in origin, or they swing it to being political) I click on their profile and see it has been created that same day.
They are only there to sow discord. Only to piss people off. Idk if we can just report them (for what?) but I’d like to try exposing them before responding and interacting…
I am guilty of gobbling up the bait. I’ve started looking at profiles of people that piss me off exceptionally and noticed they’re burner bot loser accounts.
I guess i just want to say I’ve noticed it!
Voyager has a setting to show a baby emoji next to the name of a user if their account is less than a month old and an account age. Probably one of the best features I’ve ever seen for immediately recognizing troll accounts.
I find at least one commenter with a new account on almost every post with more than 5 comments.
They tend to be negative.
Think I’m going to start welcoming them to Lemmy, note their activity to date, and ask them nicely what might have brought them to join. (If they are real, glad to have them, but I have found most Lemmy members came here from Reddit, not to make accounts to post in News or Politics or such places trolls would like.)
Until Lemmy updates to identify new accounts ala Voyager, I think that would be helpful to inform other users they may be talking to a troll.
There are approximately 433k accounts but only 48k Monthly Active Users.
It’s hard to believe that many of posts and comments are often the newest accounts, and though they will change tactics to using older accounts, at least it’s more work for them.
I recommend others do the same.
So, now that you spend half your time on Lemmy being a narc, have you considered moving on to actually contributing meaningful comments and content, or are you content with just being a stool-pigeon that harasses new users?
(Checks your comment history)
Ah, so just the same comment over and over again for weeks on end. Fucking spammer…
Hey look, a new very active account, talking shit about… Hmmm…
Nazis, trump, cops, Russians, gays, etc!
Yeah, people like you are why I point it out new accounts.
And from the way you communicate rudely here, to me for saying “Welcome” to new members, illustrates a great point that you don’t seem to be someone worth talking to, likely by anyone.
Have a great day, and looking forward to Welcoming your next alt.
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Is voyager an app like Sync?
Yes, and no ads either.
Yes
Ya, Lemmy is speed running the worst things about Reddit but struggling to build the niche communities that would make people want to hang around.
The thing that’s making me kinda want to leave is it feels like even more of an echo chamber then Reddit was, especially when you see someone calling for the death of someone at least once a week or so
Quite often see people getting downvote bombed and dogpiled for having different political opinions
I left reddit because I fucking hate the company.
But I’m not happy here because I fucking hate the users.
Me even typing a response to your comment make me 70% more likely to get banned in the few hours.
It’s infectuous
Great summary.
Yes but not that much I see the communities are starting to materialize but many that are a 1 to 1 copy didn’t took off sadly the Warframe one is a good example, but you see the pixel dungeon one is going great even Evan00 (the dev of shattered) is buzzing in and the helldivers2 is starting to get to the frontpages. I guess the fediverse moves in a more organical way? Regarding the trolls is normal is a “ladran Sancho” situation, we are getting more people in and that includes idiots. Sadlly/Luckly idiots comes in the full spectrum of races backgrounds and preferences.
The ones that stand out to me are the ones that take offense at mundane things, because they’re looking at it through a skewed mental filter. As far as I can tell, they’re genuine. I don’t know what to make of it, so I just make liberal use of the block button.
That’s some fucking ableist bullshit, not everyone is neurotypical you know. Fucking bigot.
You are really proving his point, eh? Or are you being silly and trolling him? I seriously cannot tell.
Could be genuine. People with a skewed mental filter don’t like to be reminded by someone with an upright one
Not trolling per se, more like an experiment.
I agree with OP that I’m sick of brain dead people picking some random bullshit to engage in. But clearly lemmy as a community has lost the ability to “don’t feed the troll”. Or in other words, lemmings get just as angry against the random bullshit as the random bullshitter is angry for his random bullshit.
The correct response to my post should have been “that’s probably satire”. Instead lemmy went 😡😡😡
The correct response to my post should have been “that’s probably satire”. Instead lemmy went 😡😡😡
But at the end of the day, how do you truly know, either way?
Especially when people don’t label it as such with a /s.
Understanding context is a skill that has atrophied in younger generations. Reading comprehension is not really being taught in school anymore.
forgot the /s
I didn’t forget, I left it off to see what would happen. Went about as I expected.
forgot the /s
This.
Part of the attraction of this place is that it is like things used to be for the most part. Freedom of expression has always been a double edged sword that all of us have to be responsible for. When you start asking others to police an environment, youre giving up that freedom not just for those you find distasteful but for yourself as well. If you simply excercise due diligence in your consumption, you can easily learn what is comfortably digestible and what will give you a heart attack
Use the report button when you see those, it’s the quickest way for them to be noticed by mods and admins.
People don’t report shit, then complain stuff goes unmoderated.
Like, you don’t have to report every single comment a troll makes, but at least report one so a mod looks at it.
Edit:
Here’s a good example. An account I have blocked replied to me. If they go into a sub I moderate and start acting like a jackass, I’ll never know because I have them blocked.
The only way I’d see it, is if someone reported it.
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People do report stuff, get yelled at by the mods, and then get banned by the admins for abuse of the reporting system, or mod abuse for getting clarification.
So if you do what you are supposed to, you get banned.
Would be better if moderation was actually taken seriously and the admins don’t excuse terrible mod behavior.
Those sound like extremely edge cases and are not a good reason to not justify not reporting anything.
Moderators are volunteers and most of them simply want to make their communities better, so they do take these reports seriously. Plus at this stage Lemmy lacks robust tools to help them accomplish this. The very least general users can do is flag problem comments and accounts to help them out.
There’s posts about mods complaining about users using the report button as a “super downvote” you go to those posts, there are people legit trolling in them and the content is still there.
The excuse is, Lemmy needs content, so they are very loose and liberal in applying moderation like that against users that add content.
I’ve had an admin defend a mod when I reported them with “they aren’t as bad as some of the others”. So Lemmy admins know they have moderation issues, if they fix it, they lose their content and their free labor. So they just turn a blind eye and let the mods do what they want, which is quite frankly nothing. And when asked they report you to the admins. They really only deal with illegal stuff unfortunately, since they have to or they can get in shit personally.
Trolls unfortunately add content, which is desperately needed. Some communities deal with it, larger let it go for discussion and metrics sake. Lemmy isn’t perfect, and we should be able to discuss its darker side.
Are you talking about Lemmy.ml specifically or Lemmy in general?
Ugghh that’s a good point, this was .world for admins, but the moderation issues seem to be non instance specific.
Also makes me wonder if some of the trolling is dealt with and its federation issues then…
Still, the amount of trolling comments, and users being banned for pretty frivolous things isn’t a good look.
There’s also a fine line between legitimate trolling and having unpopular or dissenting opinion. I’ve seen plenty of threads where 2 or more people are arguing about a given topic, and while the unpopular opinion isn’t being inflammatory or breaking any rules, they still get their comments removed after being down voted into the ground. It’s happened to me as well.
My only contention with this is finding a way to foster conversation without censoring opinions just because they’re not widely shared. As long as the argument is in good faith, mods shouldn’t be removing content they don’t agree with, only those that are inflammatory, overly insulting, blatant trolling/shilling, or breaking community rules.
Trolling is simply noise and garbage to dispose of when it becomes an attack on the person. It brings nothing of value and it diminishes the value of everything else it pollutes.
Trolling is simply noise and garbage to dispose of when it becomes an attack on the person.
Trolling doesn’t ONLY require personal attacks…. That’s the issue, mods only step in when things progress too far and have reached that point….
Here’s a good example. An account I have blocked replied to me. If they go into a sub I moderate and start acting like a jackass, I’ll never know because I have them blocked.
The only way I’d see it, is if someone reported it.
This is why, when I was a reddit moderator (r/Firefox), I never blocked users even if they were absolute trash to me. I always thought of that as a severe limitation of the platform, there should be a setting to show blocked user’s content (labelled as such) in communities you moderate.
Unpopular opinion but I rather downvote. I want to see people’s bad opinions instead of pretending they don’t exist.
Assholes are everywhere, but yeah, it’s been happening slowly but surely ever since lemmy has gained more users (which makes sense).
I’d really like to know the ratio of assholes to regular people out of every 100 people 😂
An ever increasing ratio because assholes drive out non assholes.
Dead Sea effect in action.
Good theory; makes sense
I noticed votes related to political comments are suddenly shifting to the right which was different just 1 week ago.
Absolutely this. We are in for a ride!
I think I’m seeing something different, although also synthetic in nature.
It seems like companies or brands are in here (and probably on any social media) actively controlling the message about their brand. People make a post or comment about a specific thing (or person) and you get pre-packages responses, similar in nature and argument.
It makes you feel like it’s tin foil hat time, but I’ve seen different accounts proporting the same exact experiences about a product, which are super specific in nature.
I could see that being a part of a company trying to actively “control the message,” but it makes you question the authenticity of a lot of posts or arguments. Is that person really standing up for this thing with a questionable history, or are they a paid shill?
What would be a safe space from this though? A forum small enough to stay under the radar? I enjoy larger platforms like this because of the diversity in content and viewpoints, but not if it’s a haven for corporate messaging or agencies controlling a narrative.
Am I joining the tin foil hat club here, or has anyone else seen similar?
I disagree. This place isn’t big enough. The nerdiest people I know don’t even know what it is. I worked at a Dev tools company and I spoke to devs all day and everyone is still on Reddit. Nobody corporate cares enough to spend that time here, especially in what’s pretty much an overblown Linux dick-sucking-competition forum. The fake libertarians are ripe for alt right indoctrination however. That, plus the wannabe commies and fake leftists, Russia and China can pickup a few votes from the West here and there.
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I hope you’re right
Shoutout to Voyager, for automatically marking new accounts with a baby emoji. It’s a feature ripped straight from Apollo, and it should honestly be the standard.
This app has a lot of great features, it actually convinced me to sign up.
Wefwef also has it.
Wefwef is Voyager under a different name. It’s literally the same app.
Is there a reason to have one over the other?
I was going to say I would be happy if just the Lemmy website allowed you to filter out comments based on the age of the account of the comment being made, but a lot of times accounts are created then are left dormant for sixish months and then are used for nefarious reasons.
Yeah, even filtering by karma/post count/comment count isn’t a perfect solution because karma farming bots are 100% a thing. It’s one of those “you can slow them down but you’ll never stop them” scenarios.
As soon as anyone starts arguing in bad faith I just block them. I don’t really care what they have to say about me for my argument.
The only problem with blocking is they still see your comments you make, and can respond to them negatively, and you have no way of defending yourself because you haven’t seen their comment.
My wish would be for blocking to prevent those who are blocked from reading comments from the blocker.
Stopping viewing on a per-account basis doesn’t make sense to me, since people don’t need accounts to view any content in Lemmy, therefore it’s trivial to bypass by logging out or fetching the discussion information without logging in from a custom frontend. What would be better is simply stopping them from interracting, just like what happens with bans, they can still view but all interractions are simply dropped or disallowed.
I would love better blocking. But I understand the costs of doing that in a truly federated environment. I’ll just settle for not caring what they actually say about me. The whole point of the trolling is to get a rise out of someone.
I wish you could set a personal minimum “karma” and age requirement. Like I don’t want to hear from anyone with an account made in the last week. And no one with karma below zero.
It’s not really a high bar, it mainly blocks people who get banned all the time.
How do you even see karma?
I dunno. It was there before. Maybe just total their last 5 comment scores. So it’s easy to just not be a dick all the time and get through the filter.
But how would one acquire karma if no one sees their comments?
Also automatically shadow banning new users will mean cool people that come to the site will get the impression that it sucks and leave and never come back.
You could just block users with a total < 0 points for those comments.
Yeah, it’s extremely easy to not be blocked.
Oh the cool people are long gone /s
Karma is easily falsified on the lemmyverse though. I have a maintenance user and a normal user on my server, I can use them both to vote, and thats just easy and not even intentional.
The whole of Lemmy is, in general, severely under-moderated.
Part of it is personnel (being a moderator is a crappy job and we don’t have the people to do it) but it’s also ideological. A lot of people here believe that allowing disruptive speech is better than suppressing expression.
That’s a choice and we live with the consequences.
A lot of people here believe that allowing disruptive speech is better than suppressing expression.
Yep! Imo it’s the only way to beat trolls. If you suppress it, your still giving it attention and publicity. Your also playing into their game that they will claim you sensor truth.
Imo if you tell someone: “yeah, come to lemmy, voice your opinion. We won’t ban you but if we mostly disagree and ignore, clearly your idea was not with its salt”.
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removed by mod
Anything much outside of the mods’ pro-Russian, pro-CCP, pro-Hamas narrative on /c/worldnews is frequently removed and the user banned. Pro-Western users have a strict bigotry standard applied, while anti-Western users can say anything.
I noticed somebody who wrote “death to amerikkka” was given official mod sanction (saying that it was a country not a people group) so I made the same comment about the CCP.
Comment removed. Banned.
Confirmed.
Uses the racist abbreviation used by nazis
Gets banned for like 3 days tops
“This is oppression. I’m being oppressed.”
“Racist” - learn the difference between a state and a race.
Everybody calls the CCP the CCP. This is literally a “Nazis drink water” situation.
Death to the CCP. Death to all other fascist groups.
What coherent theory of fascism puts Nazi Germany and modern China in that same bucket? https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Fascism
Fascism, usually understood in Marxist theory as capitalism in decay, is a counter-revolutionary reactionary movement led by finance capital, and a form of dictatorship of the bourgeoisie which emerged during periods of economic crisis in imperialist countries. The Third International described fascism as the “open, terrorist dictatorship of the most reactionary, most chauvinistic, and most imperialist elements of finance capital.”
Fascism abolishes bourgeois democracy without abolishing bourgeois rule itself. […]
Fascism usually promotes policies that favour the ever-expanding domination of capital. Its political aspect is marked by pervasive anti-communism, a profound aversion towards democracy, the justification and glorification of class society through class collaboration, and chauvinistic tendencies, namely reactionary nationalism, racism, sexism, and ableism. Fascist ideologues usually promote conspiracy theories, irrational myths and manipulative distortions of truth to gather support of their popular base.
Fascism abolishes bourgeois democracy without abolishing bourgeois rule itself. […]
Look no further than the capitalist class at the top of the CCP. Its imperialist initiatives. Its reactionary treatment of Muslims, LGBT people, etc.
Inb4 internal propaganda. Nazis say Jews got great swimming pools.
Inb4 internal propaganda.
No idea what that’s supposed to mean, but let’s go through the bog-standard Five Eyes Kool Aid you’ve presented.
Look no further than the capitalist class at the top of the CCP.
The capitalist class is not at the top of the CPC. China is a proletarian state, where the capitalist class is not in control: China’s housing minister says real estate developers must go bankrupt if necessary. Whereas the US is a bourgeois state, where the capitalist class is in control.
The US Federal Reserve is just the cartel of the US private banks and they also largely control the Treasury. Whereas banking in China is predominantly state owned. The Chinese state both runs these banks and has fiat monetary sovereignty, so it’s not answerable to the capitalists. A bit of a tangent/background: Why The Government Has Infinite Money
Its imperialist initiatives.
What imperialist initiatives? The US has over 750 overseas bases around the world and is installing more right now in order to further encircle China. Meanwhile China has one anti-piracy base on the coast of Djibouti. https://lemmy.ml/comment/10148422
Its reactionary treatment of Muslims, LGBT people, etc.
What reactionary treatment of Muslims? They get material support from the state just as other religions do, despite the CPC being formally atheist/agnostic. Their official position is that religions will eventually wither away on their own.
Or did you really mean Uyghurs? They and other ethic minorities were excepted from the One-Child policy, and in Xinjiang they have grown in numbers relative to Hans as a result.
In accordance with China’s affirmative action policies towards ethnic minorities, all non-Han ethnic groups were subject to different laws and were usually allowed to have two children in urban areas, and three or four in rural areas.
I’ve beaten the “Uyghur genocide” (“cultural” or otherwise) psyop to death already: https://lemmy.ml/comment/10145782
LGBT people
I’m not very familiar with China’s current situation on this large topic. The US isn’t exactly a shining beacon on a hill here: been to Tennessee or Florida lately? Even the distorted stories we get US Cold War II think tanks and corporate media don’t put things anywhere near fascism. The US has a whole human rights concern troll industrial complex aimed at countries it wants to regime change.
etc.
What etcetera? You know what, here are answers to some of your next questions: https://lemmy.ml/comment/9448375
Yea, I have gotten comments removed and banned several times from lemmy.ml for disagreeing with literal and easily disproven Russian propaganda. You don’t even need to be pro anything, just disagreeing with Russia does it.
Yea, I have gotten comments removed and banned several times from lemmy.ml for disagreeing with literal and easily disproven Russian propaganda. You don’t even need to be pro anything, just disagreeing with Russia does it.
You think moderators remove those comments? (/s)
Protip: by replying to a comment on many apps, you can see the content of the comment. This can be very useful.
You can also check the modlogs. They can be really revealing.
/c/worldnews
Which one? There’s one on every instance.
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What did you say?
According to moderators, even using the word “CCP” makes you a racist orientalist Nazi.
If that sounds like the neolib tactic of calling all criticism of Israel (or even the Netanyahu regime) “antisemitic” that’s because it is.
That’s not what they said, though, and that’s not what you said either. I understand wanting to make your case, but you understated what got removed and overstated the reaction, which was just a removed comment and a 1 day ban for Orientalism.
You didn’t critique the CPC either, unless you think calling for death is critique.
If you stalked my comment history, then you’re being extremely selective and disingenuous, or very lazy.
“Death to Amerikkka” is not a critique either. But it is allowed by moderators. Do you condemn that equally?
A political party is not a race.
Death to the CCP.
To quote @davel@lemmy.ml : Reporter, please learn the difference between a people and a state.
Nah, I just checked the modlog against your name, I didn’t stalk it.
I didn’t say “Death to Amerikkka” is a critique, you said critiquing the CCP gets you removed, but you didn’t critique the CPC as evidenced by the modlog. I think it was more cringe than anything.
Some threads have a handful of interactions that seem less than genuine, yes. Usually political and derailing and spoil the thread.
Yes. Especially in subs like “Canada” or any post involving Canada in any way
It does not matter what the topic of the thread or conversation is. It can be about how Canada loves puppies. And there will be random 1 or 2 liners from new accounts making political comments heavily pushing specific agendas. Even completely unrelated
Lots of random anti government misinformation and one liners pushing a specific party misinformation and narrative. Our how we’re some 3rd world collapsing country
It is not natural. Same thing occurs also on Reddit.
Yes, Im also glad im not the only one who noticed this. But it also seems to be they disapper after a few days too, maybe instance mods banned them or they just got bored.
I fit your definition. Now lemme 'splain:
For thirty-five years I have heard nothing but radical right fascism spewing hate, lies, vitriol, slander, and violent rhetoric- over the airwaves, cable, and now social media- and without the slightest bit of challenge or pushback. The amount and volume increased when they figured out it pays big money. The people who listen have never known that it was for entertainment; they are being edged to violence just like Ruwandan radio did.
Liberals have been major pussies and doormats about this because they have no idea who they’re dealing with. They cannot be reasoned with or appealed to through humanity. The radical fascists’ free speech rights do not exist and are not to be defended; there is absolutely nothing to gain there and everything to lose. As I said, liberals have no idea who they’re dealing with.
For all the unchecked violence and damaged caused by the radical fascist shitbags to our daily lives, our long term properity, and to safety and security in general, I absolutely attack them with all the violent and vitriolic slander I can muster to pay back for thirty-five plus years of the same. This is the route every one of you should take, because they all think you’re a bunch of pussies and they take great joy in running you over. They must be made to fear even being seen in public, and beaten down like rabid dogs when they are. They are enemies of freedom, enemies of humanity, and enemies of all that is good in the world.
A lemmy.world account with a spine? 😳😳😳
God damn, color me pleasantly surprised!
Yeah that’s a new one. They deserve a better class of fed.
