The compression artifacts (from converting B/W line art to jpg) being printed on the page have given me a new pet peeve
Now imagine these corrupted images being engraved into stone or steel by machine. Turned into literal artifacts for future generations to ponder over.
“The intentional grey diamonds, you see this was a highly advanced society capable of high definition videos and images, represents a loving fealty to that which is complete or known. The imperfections in the art represent an acknowledgement of their societal short falls. This will be on the exam by the way.”
"There is much debate about how aware the primitive minds were of the degradation of their information. Did they believe older things looked worse when they were photographed or did they understand it was their photographs themselves that got worse over time?
Even more surprising is that their oldest media wasn’t even able to maintain any information at all about colour."
“In fact, here is one now:“
Jpg for photos, png for everything else.
It’s an easy rule of thumb, it hurts that 20 years of repeating it seems to have had zero effect.
Maybe this helps: Jpg fucks up your image, and png doesn’t.
Or: jpg is lossy, png is lossless.
Or: It’s better to save photos as png than cartoons as jpg.
Seriously, I hope some of this breaks through because deep fried images are so fucking unnecessary.
John Warnock is rolling in his grave right now.
At which point does an egg of non-chicken become an egg of chicken?
Chickenness is a spectrum, not a binary
Is archeopteryx a chicken?
I’ve never seen one run from a fight.
That’s quite controversial.
When first chicken lay egg, duh!
Unless you define a chicken egg as an egg of which a chicken is born (or of which a chicken could be born)
Doesn’t matter as it’s not a stated in the question. It just needs to be an egg.
When genetic mutation happened between non-chicken and its egg to create real chicken
The chicken vs egg question has never been about chronology or science.
It’s been about religion vs science.
Science says the egg came first: something nearly imperceptibly not quite a chicken laid an egg that hatched a chicken. That’s how evolution works, with the egg coming first.
Religion says a god poofed a chicken into existence. The chicken came first, and only ever laid pure chicken eggs. The eggs will forever hatch a chicken and nothing but a chicken.
That’s the chicken vs egg thing. It’s not a puzzle at all, it’s just science vs religion.
e: simplified. I’m too wordy by default.
You can interpret it that way now but that’s not the original meanig.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_or_the_egg
I understand and respect where you are coming from but i prefer not to rewrite history while arguing about ideas.
Yes, thank you, you’re exactly right. The person you’re responding to is correct that it’s come to have science vs religion overtones, but that’s not what the expression meant to people for ages and ages.
You’re right, I shouldn’t have said ‘never’. It was a paradox in ancient history, but at least in my lifetime, I’ve read it as basically solved. That may be a relatively recent stance (since 100-200 years ago), but it doesn’t seem useful to continue presenting it as a paradox at this point.
literally no one in the world means that when they talk about chicken vs egg. what a weird way to look at the world.
also citation needed on religion saying god proofed chicken into existence without the egg.
It made Fox News in 2015.
A biology paper that same year.
Religious people seem to care.
Biologists have been talking about it.
I didn’t pull this out of my arse.
And re: that citation you asked for:
God created mature birds with the ability to reproduce. So the bird was first, ready to lay eggs.
first of all kudos on the citations; thank you for your effort.
I don’t think these prove that the question is about religion vs science. the question is philosophical, and the fact that some religious people have a take on it that doesn’t agree with what would be the scientific/technical answer doesn’t make it about religion vs science.
if a tree falls and no one around to hear it, does it make a sound? that would also have a scientific answer, and depending on the religion, you may have a religious argument that disagrees with the scientific answer. the question would remain a philosophical one, and not one of science vs religion.
I wasn’t trying to prove the question is about religion vs science; I was responding to the previous comment that said:
literally no one in the world means that
My links show lots of people in the world say that. Not everyone, but enough that it does come up sometimes.
There are multiple facets and perspectives in every philosophical question.
I think there are two valid scientific/philosophical answers without taking religion into it, based on one question:
Are we specifically talking a chicken egg, or the concept of an egg?
In the former case, eggshells contain compounds that cannot exist in nature, and must come from a creature. a chicken egg cannot exist without a chicken before it, thus the chicken came first.
In the latter case, various evolutionary splits happened between animals evolving egg developing capability and some animals evolving into chickens. From this we can say that the egg came before the chicken.
Worst case, this solved exactly nothing. Best case, it can be an exercise in reasoning.
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This is by far the most correct answer to the chicken and egg question.
I don’t like this because it’s not addressing the actual saying. Obviously the saying is about chicken eggs specifically.
But I’ve always felt obviously the egg came first. The first chicken was born in an egg, so the egg came first. That egg could have been produced from a creature with a mutation which caused it to produce the first chicken egg when it is not itself the exact same species.
Ah, but when that line of tiny change is so arbitrary… Is it a true chicken until it grows up and fulfils its destiny? Is it a chicken based purely on its genetic code, so the egg whence it hatched is a chicken egg; or is it truly a chicken when it becomes a chicken… meh, I write this far and find I still agree with you: even in that case the egg it hatched from becomes a chicken egg by virtue of the chicken it grew into.
It’s somehiw obvious now, but the question appeared 25 centuries ago when it wasn’t even remotely clear what was the answer.
I believe this is correct as I read in a book somewhere that it was a kind of proto-chicken if you will, that laid an egg of which came a the first chicken.
The more interesting question is how long did it take for the first BBQ Chicken.
Real question is which came first, BBQ chicken or the Eggs Benedict?
That is an interesting one.
I did a quick search using Arc and it says eggs Benedict was 1860s and BBQ. Chicken is unknown.
Over time, a population of proto-chickens lay eggs with unique genetic variations that randomly direct the population towards laying eggs that result in modern chickens. The egg comes first, and it’s a whole bunch of them
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I very much like that I have a clear cut answer for this now.
I know this is a science meme community but the amount of factually inaccurate comments is concerning.
There are more stars in the galaxy than there are atoms in the universe
This cladogram is outdated about turtles, which are no longer considered the most phylogenetically basal reptiles.
Last I heard they might be closer to crocs and birds than to zards and snakes
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TIL turtles are older than crocodiles
No, turtles and crocodiles share an older closest common ancestor than lizards and crocodiles.
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The egg came first. To the chickens disappointment and, who left to find a more satisfying partner.
And now everybody together… C O E V O L U T I O N
I thought this was a T-shirt and now I want it on a tshirt
egg laying animals came long before chickens, why was that ever hard to figure out for anyone?
Well some of us are not only ignorant but had our critical thinking skills to varying levels stunted by shitty education. To me the answer didn’t necessarily matter as long as people agree both exist, but I’m glad to now have an answer grounded in science rather than relying on philosophical musing
but had our critical thinking skills to varying levels stunted by shitty education.
I’ve also noticed that everyone I went to school with who got good grades is a dunce. But everyone who got shitty grades with me was much easier to talk to.
I never have to explain in verbose detail what I mean by every fragment of a sentence to someone who got shitty grades in school. I had a principal at one school I went to who was an idiot.
Every time another group of students stole my hat and there was a coordinated effort to keep it away from me, I had no choice but to go to the principal, because the teachers wouldn’t help me either.
Every single time this happened, the principal, with zero self awareness would say “what do you mean ____ stole your hat? did you give it to him?” Then I had to explain in vivid detail each thing that happened for 15 minutes, like I was programming a robot-arm in a factory to this idiot with no ability to listen and think.
George Carlin used to rant about how schools teach kids to just barely be smart enough to pull levers and push buttons, but never to critically think about things or to solve problems they don’t have a pre-planned solution for. and that’s why I hated going to school, as high functioning autistic man, when I was in school, they always wanted me to fit into a cookie-cutter path they set for me, but I never went along with it.
This one boomer I know refuses to ever use anything except for the official tool you’re supposed to use for each thing. So I ask him, “well if this other pair of plyers does the job, why can’t I just use this one if I can make it work.?” “IT’S NOT MEANT FOR THAT!” with no good reason for not wanting me to help him by using that other pair of plyers that I can make work.
I quit high school about half way through my 10th grade year one day when literally everyone in the school yelled at me when I tried to talk about literally anything. I just got my stuff out of my locker and walked home.
