Except she follows the law, she just finds loopholes that you could throw a nuke through. She announced her attack on the factory, and didn’t attack the town. She also wrote a dissertation on how to shell a town legally.
I’d say lawful evil, trending towards neutral evil
I’d figure Chaotic neutral because to be evil you have to actively do things with malice. If it’s for personal gain according to their personal morality, it’s neutral because they could fall in line with the law by coincidence.
Doing evil because it’s fun and doing evil because it’s profitable are both evil. An evil alignment doesn’t require you to relish the screams of your victims - you just have to decide “those lives are not as important as what I want.”
Then there’s no difference between apathy and evil according to you guys. Not caring if someone dies from your actions is the same as gleefully killing them. Makes total sense.
That’s the idea. Evil is apathy. Peter Singer is willing to make personal sacrifices to help others, and tries to figure out how to help people as much as possible with limited resources. There’s no Evil Peter Singer that makes personal sacrifices to hurt others and tries to figure out how to hurt them as much as possible with limited resources. Evil people are people who just don’t care, and harm others whenever it benefits them.
But maybe in something like D&D where there’s demons, they actually care about causing suffering and the people we think of as evil are merely neutral.
To be Neutral is to be able to do not only good things, bad things, but to also abstain from both. Neutral is ‘boring’ because it doesn’t lock your character into an alignment. You aren’t forced to help people, you aren’t forced to harm people, your character does what would make sense for your character to do, even if it means doing nothing.
Good aligned characters aren’t “forced” to help people if they have a reason not to. Nor are they “forbidden” from stealing. A single act does not determine an alignment and alignment isn’t a cage restricting player autonomy.
Not caring if someone dies from your actions is the same as gleefully killing them.
Giving 100 gold to a beggar and donating your time and 10 000 gold to an orphanage are not the same thing, but the existence of the 2nd option doesn’t make the first option neutral.
No. Their behavior is self interested. That’s Evil. Didn’t matter how they envision it or whether they have a personal code. If their personal code places the needs of others and the general welfare in a place of high importance then they are Good. Chaotic - Lawful merely describes the methods they’re willing to pursue to achieve those goals.
Self-interest is not evil. Self-interest is a core trait to surviving. Egocentrism is abrasive but also isn’t in itself, evil. An egotistical hero is still a hero even if they save people only for the sake of getting credit for it.
Listen. You need to go out and touch some grass. No one is making a moral argument here. We’re debating a game’s alignment system and how to understand it. In terms of the game’s systems, self-interest is evil. Devils are extremely self-interested and do nothing for the greater good or general welfare.
Yes and I think you have no idea what you’re talking about so take that grass touching advice for yourself and stop replying to my comments with the dumbest shit I’ve heard on this site. “Self-interest is inherently evil!” the fuck it is.
Look, I’m an atheist so I don’t believe in evil. That being said I’m not 13 so I also don’t have a hard-on for Ayn Rand to the point where I get enraged when other people talk about self interest.
I never said anything about it being “inherently evil”. You’re putting words in my mouth. You’d realize that if you actually took some time to cool off.
In the context of D&D, how self-interested a character is determines their moral alignment. It’s a loose description of a mechanic.
Except she follows the law, she just finds loopholes that you could throw a nuke through. She announced her attack on the factory, and didn’t attack the town. She also wrote a dissertation on how to shell a town legally.
I’d say lawful evil, trending towards neutral evil
That sounds like chaotic lawful to me.
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I’d figure Chaotic neutral because to be evil you have to actively do things with malice. If it’s for personal gain according to their personal morality, it’s neutral because they could fall in line with the law by coincidence.
Doing evil because it’s fun and doing evil because it’s profitable are both evil. An evil alignment doesn’t require you to relish the screams of your victims - you just have to decide “those lives are not as important as what I want.”
Then there’s no difference between apathy and evil according to you guys. Not caring if someone dies from your actions is the same as gleefully killing them. Makes total sense.
“Not caring if someone dies from your actions” is basically the definition of negligent homicide.
That’s the idea. Evil is apathy. Peter Singer is willing to make personal sacrifices to help others, and tries to figure out how to help people as much as possible with limited resources. There’s no Evil Peter Singer that makes personal sacrifices to hurt others and tries to figure out how to hurt them as much as possible with limited resources. Evil people are people who just don’t care, and harm others whenever it benefits them.
But maybe in something like D&D where there’s demons, they actually care about causing suffering and the people we think of as evil are merely neutral.
Yep, this is basically the “Evil is the Absence of Good” argument, and you could do way worse.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absence_of_good
To be Neutral is to be able to do not only good things, bad things, but to also abstain from both. Neutral is ‘boring’ because it doesn’t lock your character into an alignment. You aren’t forced to help people, you aren’t forced to harm people, your character does what would make sense for your character to do, even if it means doing nothing.
Good aligned characters aren’t “forced” to help people if they have a reason not to. Nor are they “forbidden” from stealing. A single act does not determine an alignment and alignment isn’t a cage restricting player autonomy.
Giving 100 gold to a beggar and donating your time and 10 000 gold to an orphanage are not the same thing, but the existence of the 2nd option doesn’t make the first option neutral.
No. Their behavior is self interested. That’s Evil. Didn’t matter how they envision it or whether they have a personal code. If their personal code places the needs of others and the general welfare in a place of high importance then they are Good. Chaotic - Lawful merely describes the methods they’re willing to pursue to achieve those goals.
Self-interest is not evil. Self-interest is a core trait to surviving. Egocentrism is abrasive but also isn’t in itself, evil. An egotistical hero is still a hero even if they save people only for the sake of getting credit for it.
Listen. You need to go out and touch some grass. No one is making a moral argument here. We’re debating a game’s alignment system and how to understand it. In terms of the game’s systems, self-interest is evil. Devils are extremely self-interested and do nothing for the greater good or general welfare.
Yes and I think you have no idea what you’re talking about so take that grass touching advice for yourself and stop replying to my comments with the dumbest shit I’ve heard on this site. “Self-interest is inherently evil!” the fuck it is.
Look, I’m an atheist so I don’t believe in evil. That being said I’m not 13 so I also don’t have a hard-on for Ayn Rand to the point where I get enraged when other people talk about self interest.
I never said anything about it being “inherently evil”. You’re putting words in my mouth. You’d realize that if you actually took some time to cool off.
In the context of D&D, how self-interested a character is determines their moral alignment. It’s a loose description of a mechanic.
No one is making claims about the real world.