Hi, im searching for a new Laptop and i was tempted to buy the framework 13… BUT…
Usually i would search for a used or refurbished Laptop to give it a second life u know. And after it broke down in like 4-6 years usually, i would buy a new used one again.
So my first question is: Is the framework 13 really worth my money for the repairability and upgradability in comparison?
My prefered Laptops are the Surface like ones 2in1 with a stand and detachable keyboard…
But im okay with it to switch to a normal laptop Formfactor.
I would prefere 16:9 or 16:10 for multimedia but im used to a 3:2 so it would be kinda okay for me to stick with it.
How good can i implement linux on some surface like laptop?
I switched from win10 to linux Mint on my desktop this year. But i think im going to switch to another distro, because i need the ASHA-protocoll as fast as possible. Maybe not that important on my desktop but definetly on my next Laptop.
Someone switched from surface like laptop to FW13?
Im not a coder. More like a gamer with og cheat codes in gtaSA on a cracked Version of the game, which runs in deamon-tools as an ISO, lol.
Main use would be Multimedia and some gaming, if possible.
Another use would be AI… but as far as i know linux doesnt support the build in NPU of the FW13 yet. Maybe ai tinker in a few years then?
And im something like a crypto bro i would say. So how good are crypto tools implemented in linux? Some cold wallet support for exampel.
Which distro would serve my needs the most?
Is there a better choice for me than FW13 ?
So all in all im hopelessly lost and cant decide shit ^^
My only hope is to ask some Linux OGs to help me out on dis.
plz halp.
Is the framework 13 really worth my money for the repairability and upgradability in comparison?
Depends on what you upgrade for, and what you need in the first place.
If you upgrade mainly for more CPU and GPU power, in my opinion that’s a hard sell. The new mainboards from Framework are hella expensive!
If you need a dGPU in a small form factor laptop, Framework just doesn’t offer that. Same for touch or built-in tablet support.
If you’re ok with the built-in GPU and upgrade for better display, for better battery, and a better but perhaps not the absolute latest and best APU, yes, it’s worth it.
When I bought the FW13, a year later or so they brought out a new 120Hz higher resolution display. The first display being 60Hz was my only big annoyance with it, having a 120Hz monitor for comparison… So I just bought the new display, and swapping it only took literal 5 minutes.
Similar story with the hinges, I wanted ones with more resistance, so I just bought stronger ones for 25€ and easily replaced them.
If the battery gets worse, or they bring out a new one with decently improved capacity, I can similarly replace it in 5 minutes.
No glue, no 10 types of special screws, just the screw driver that was shipped with the laptop, and basically zero risk of breaking anything when making modifications.
You’ll have to know yourself if these tradeoffs are worth it to you… but after my old HP Envy’s display broke and even finding the correct replacement part was a challenge, let alone replacing it, I’m quite happy with the FW13.
How sturdy is it? I currently use Ubuntu 24.04 on my MacBook 2014, and I want a laptop with the same construction quality.
Quite good I’d say. I don’t have other high end laptops for comparison though
👍🏽
Framework offers dGPU on my Framework 16, now with an upgrade too, so I bought one without a dGPU and I can now upgrade to a current gen GPU. No other company offers this right now
If you like 2-in-1 laptops, why not framework 12?
A few days ago I posted about the same thing, I wanted a Mac-like laptop but running x86 so I could run Linux properly and not through hacks. 80% of the people in the comments suggested the Framework, and for a moment I was close to getting one. But I don’t think I would be fully happy with its clunkiness to be honest. Modularized stuff are clunky we like it or not. Yes, much better for repairability, but DELL also offers me two years on site support even here in Greece, so…
At the end, I bought this DELL. It’s coming with Linux, so I know it’s 100% compatible, and I paid only 765 euros on it (after removing VAT, since I bought it also for work). That’s half the price of a Framework, with a slicker design, and it’s fast-enough (15,200 passmark cpu points). The only compromise I had to make was that the touchpad was off-center, as it’s a large laptop. Other than that, it ticks all my boxes as per my post the other day.
I had some similar concerns before buying my Framework 13. The community here helped me a lot to confirm that this is a great laptop. After 3 months of use I’m still in love with it (got mine on sale).
I had a Dell XPS 13 before that, and tested lots of mainstream brands over the years (Lenovo, Acer, Vaio… and dinosaurs like PB, Toshiba). All within a budget of ~$1200-$1500. They all did a decent job and the XPS13 was certainly the best, but they all end up going to the trash because of hardware failure after 4 years max.
I wanted to move to a company that cares about Linux and with Framework, hardware issues will not cause death of my machine anymore. I’ll be able to have my machine longer, or upgrade it for a fraction of the price of a new laptop.
https://www-gem.codeberg.page/sys_Framework13-1/ https://www-gem.codeberg.page/sys_Framework13-2/
Also, along my research before opting for Framework, I’ve heard mostly about starlab, purism, tuxedo, and system76. There’s obviously pros and cons for each brand as well as difference in opinions based on individual experience, but a common criticism for these (including Framework) less marketed brands is the price of their machines. Lots of people don’t realize that there’s reasons for a slightly high price.
Is there a better choice for me than FW13 ?
Yes. Especially if you want to game and dabble in local ML (which the 13 is unfortunately not great for, its NPU is too small and old to ever be useful).
But what’s your budget, approximately?
My budget is something like 2k €, maybe more if it worth to save some more money for.
Ah, crap, you’re in Europe.
So basically the only laptop worth anything for AI is one with the new Strix Halo AMD chips, and the closest to what you want is the Asus Z13: https://www.notebookcheck.net/Asus-ROG-Flow-Z13-GZ302EA-Convertible-Review-AMD-s-Strix-Halo-GPU-is-neck-and-neck-with-the-RTX-4070-Laptop.963266.0.html
https://shop.asus.com/us/rog/90nr0jy1-m00670-rog-flow-z13-2025.html?config=90NR0JY1-M00670
Specifically the 128GB version if you can save up, or at least the 64GB version. While most laptops are useless for ML, this one utterly blows my desktop out of the water: it’s like an of magnitude better than the Frameowrk 13 at that.
Even more importantly, LLM devs are targeting the Strix Halo chips, so they will be well supported. You can spin up a vllm, exllama or llama.cpp-rocm image on them right now, whereas you will struggle to get things up and running on most laptops older IGPs.
Coincidentally, you won’t find anything 13" that can game better either. Its a surface-like tablet too, and franky its cooling is way better than a Framework 13. It’s perfect!
…Problem is, I don’t know if you can even get it in Europe. But historically, I know Asus laptops tend to be proportionally more expensive than they are in the US for some reason, so even if you can, I’m afraid the 64GB/128GB versions would be cost prohibitive.
I only found asus rog z13 flow with 32GB here sadly.
I considered this one (https://store.minisforum.com/products/minisforum-v3) earlier but 16GB is not good at all.
I heard of a new competitor to the z13 flow, but cant remember the name.
There is a 14" HP laptop with the same chip:
https://www.ultrabookreview.com/70442-amd-strix-halo-laptops/
And a handheld, heh: https://gpdstore.net/gpd-handheld-gaming-pcs/gpd-win-5/
There may be more.
TBH, it may be prudent to wait a month or two for more “AI Max” chips to show up in laptops. It’s pretty new; Asus is just super early with it like they usually are.
Okay, i think you convinced me to wait a few months and see what will pop up on the market with this new chipset.
Yep.
FYI, rumors suggest the AI Max/Strix Halo successor won’t be coming out till H2 2027, aka nearly 2028 (as Strix Halo techically launched in January this year, but as you can see takes time to actually make it into laptops):
Anyway, what I’m saying is it won’t go obsolete anytime soon, and it will be quite strong for many years to come if you get one.
Oh, and one more thing. There’s a sizable linux community specifically built around Asus ROG laptops. Look up ‘linux rog’ and you will find associated gitlabs and a Discord specifically built up around them. It’s still a fantastic resource for my 2020 G14.
The Z13 is especially good for linux, as it has discrete-gpu-class performance on the IGP, so you don’t have to fuss with a dual GPU setup on linux (which can be a tremendous headache, especially with Nvidia cards).
As for a distro, I adore CachyOS for ML stuff, and its well suited for gaming. But its really down to your personal experience and taste.
I usually buy System76 laptops. Might look at a Framework one next go around. I like supporting the linux supply chain when I can. If money is the only concern, sure some repurposed thing is likely cheaper.
I looked into Pangolin 16 a while ago but decided framework would fit better back then.
Distros. Pick something in the top 10 of https://distrowatch.com/ .
I use Debian or one of the derivatives of Debian.
I think i will try cachy first (ai support, gaming too and its arch based so the ASHA support will be maybe faster there, than on other distros.
what’s the ASHA protocol? I doubt other distros would support it if mint (basically Ubuntu) doesn’t support it
ASHA stands for Audio Streaming for Hearing Aids, a Bluetooth protocol which runs on BLE ( Bluetooth Low Energy)
Used to buy dell precision (with a couple of lenovo in between but switched back to dell because of crappy support experience). Replaced my precision last month with TUXEDO InfinityBook Pro 14 - Gen10. Great specs for decent price. Running fedora on it. No remarks so far.
