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So I’m not so sure this is actually a Science Meme other than proving that sometimes history does repeat itself?
I was skeptical that this was actually real, but it is indeed on the NYT website and the image was taken from their “Timeline view”
Let’s see…
- Nazism
- McCarthyism
- Vietnam War
- Racial Injustice
- South African Apartheid
- Occupy Wall Street
- Gaza Genocide
- etc.
I am curious. Has there ever been a wide-scale student protest movement that WASN’T unequivocally vindicated by history?
there ever been a wide-scale student protest movement that WASN’T unequivocally vindicated by history?
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National Socialist German Student League were literal Nazis
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The Red Guards were a Student-led paramilitary group.
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Japanese Students protested against the U.S.-Japan Security Treaty (Anpo)
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Veganism?
- Veganism?
Hold up, you think the vegans are in the wrong? You can say that they’re annoying, but in terms of ethics and morals it’s not even an argument. It’s fine to not like tofu or whatever, but there is no amount of verbal gymnastics anyone can do to even begin to justify the modern meat and dairy industries. That shit is basically Animal Auschwitz times a billion.
it’s possible that the modern industry is bad and vegans are still wrong
I mainly put that in to see what reaction it would get.
For arguments sake, there is a militant strain of veganism (e.g. PETA) that is not always on the right side of history. But the damage done there is tiny compared to the other side of the scale.
The key word is “widescale”. The reason is that a malignant narcissist can get a small group of cultists to do anything. But in order to get a large group of cultists to do something, he needs a propaganda machine like fox News and they have a much older demographic
I think the examples I gave were wide-scale for their time in history.
But I don’t really want to argue against OPs point. The intelligent, not yet indoctrinated, youth are usually on the right side of history.
I completely agree with you. There might be some exceptions but in general what you say is true: when there’s a sea change, a zeigeist, young people are the first to sense it. You don’t get sweeping changes and protests at the senior care facility.
I think it’s also that the young have less to lose and more to gain. Most gen Xer are sitting around on their hands because they stand to lose much more than they gain. They have mortgage and car payments, children, and health insurance. If anything breaks, that can all come tumbling down.
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The Young Turk movement started with medical students.
There were quite a few pro-segregation protests when schools were desegregated.
There’s also a lot of cases where students with real grievances and positive intentions are coopted; most of the students protesting in the early 90s in eastern europe didn’t intend to do a color revolution and have their countries stripped for parts.
Thank you for bringing those up. However, unless I’m misunderstanding them, the only one of those where the protesters were in the wrong were the pro-segregation protests, correct? But weren’t those protests by-and-large made up of parents? (Perhaps along with some of their children doing what they were told?) Not exactly the “rebellious youth sticking it to the man” we generally mean by the words student protest.
weren’t those protests by-and-large made up of parents?
Yes and no, a number of universities had pro-segregation actions by students including protests
History is always more complicated and nuanced than any narrative would lead you to believe.
Tiananmen got deleted.
Never knew until I immigrated to the US. And even then, its merely a brief mention on it and calls it “communism” (its not lol) and then the teachers proclaim its why “communism” is bad, USA constitution rule of law blah blah.
Look how good the constitution is, its being ripped apart right now.
Sure, the western world knows it happened, but its only a few shitposters on the internet cares about it. If you go on the street and ask the average westerner, they’d have no clue on what you’re talking about.
A few posts on reddit shitposting on June 4 is not exactly being “Vindicated”.
The CCP won, they erased history.
The USA is now following the same path.
Autocrats of the world have won.
They are winning.* It’s not over yet.
It’s possible English isn’t your first language? No worries.
The word “vindicated” doesn’t mean “won in the end,” it means “they were right.” As in, justified in their demands, on the right side of history. Even of the protests I listed in my first comment, half of them didn’t actually win in the end (Vietnam, Occupy, Gaza, and arguably more).
From Wikipedia:
…(the Seven Demands) for the government:
- Affirm Hu Yaobang’s views on democracy and freedom as correct.
- Admit that the campaigns against spiritual pollution and bourgeois liberalisation had been wrong.
- Publish information on the income of state leaders and their family members.
- Allow privately run newspapers and stop press censorship.
- Increase funding for education and raise intellectuals’ pay.
- End restrictions on demonstrations in Beijing.
- Provide objective coverage of students in official media.[84][83]
I hope that you’d agree that the students were in the right, and that the oppressive CCP was in the wrong?
In Mainland China, most people don’t know about Tiananmen, the older people who heard about it didn’t know much unless they were in Beijing, my parents (in Guangdong province at the time) just think its some kids “causing trouble”.
Most of the liberalizations goals failed, there is no free press. China is a State-Capitalist dictatorship.
Yes, I understand that. Perhaps I was not empathetic enough, I am sorry to hear that about your family being deceived, along with the rest of mainland China.
The fact that the oppressive CCP won does not mean they were right. The world is not a Disney movie, the good guys don’t always win.
“Vindicated” just means that the good guys were good. Whether or not they won.
Dictionary Definition:
vindicate *verb* - 1 a: to free from allegation or blame - b (1): confirm, substantiate - (2): to provide justification or defense for : justify - c : to protect from attack or encroachment : defend - 2 : avenge - 3 : to maintain a right to - 4 obsolete : to set free : deliverhttps://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/vindicate
So imagine a person defending against an assailant and inadvertently kills him.
The polices comes and accuses the person for murder, but its self defence.
So the man get convicted for murder.
Sure, his family may believe him. Some friend may believe him. A rebel group might also believe him.
But most people either don’t care or just believe what the police says.
The man spends life in prison. And his identity, records, papers are all shredded.
He may be in the right, but that’s not exactly being “vindicated”.
Vindicated is:
to free from allegation or blame
Yea maybe in the west, but in Mainland China, it doesn’t exist. Those who witnessed it thinks it was a riot.
Being “Vindicated” would be the CCP topples, and the new government shares the truth.
wasn’t the Red Guard also a student movement? it didn’t get deleted, but it’s definitely not looked back upon fondly. tbf most of what I know of it comes from Three Body Problem though, so I could be wrong.
there’s also the Red Army Faction (Baader-Meinhoff gang) in Germany during the '70s which killed some people.
If they won they wouldn’t still be trying to exert power. It’s not over until they stop.
Weren’t they revoking degrees now for protestors? Anyone who considers Columbia a real school at this point is incurable.
Haven’t seen that, just the green card of one of the organizers.
Given enough time, we were always going to have right wing authoritarians back in power.
But call me an idealist, I didn’t think it would be actual Nazi sympathizers. Thought the brand was appropriately tarnished what with the Holocaust.
Thought the brand was appropriately tarnished what with the Holocaust.
I wish I had the faith in humanity you have
Yes, yes, every piece slowly falls into place. *Cue maniacal villain laughter
It’s like they actually studied history, to try and replicate the desired results as identically as possible. Or they didn’t, at all, and this is just 2+2=4 scenario but with history.
The more things change…
