I am an Indian and I have noticed that Indians are way too proud of their country for some reason and at the same time lack any civic sense towards it, they are extremely loud and extremely proud. We feel like the world revolves around India and our culture is superior to that of others. Also, a considerable chunk of the population has been sold the “India is a world-leader” myth and they think India is somehow leading the world in innovation, science and technology, human development etc.,
Now, I know for a fact that this is not true, when I try to gauge the perception of Indians abroad on Twitter, I get pretty negative results, but Twitter has nothing good to say about any group of people, so… I kinda wanted to know what you people though of India, don’t base it upon the etnic Indians who might be your friends and are decent people, but base it upon the news you read, the stories you hear from those Indians, etc.
It was the loudest and smelliest country I’ve ever been to.
I’ve never seen a country where the cross-country sleeper train bathrooms had literal holes on the floor to shit and piss out of. You saw the tracks wizz below you from the toilets. No plumbing, just excrete onto the tracks.
Chennai train station had the strongest most overwhelming diarrhea smell I ever experienced in my entire life.
Dudes were creepy as hell. They see you’re white and then you’re swarmed everywhere you go. People trying to scam, trying to appoint themselves as your tour guide and won’t stop following you and trying to guide you to “the mall”. Calling you Harry Potter because you wear glasses. I couldn’t imagine what would happen if I was a woman there. I shudder to think.
Crossing the street means walking into oncoming traffic and hoping and trusting everyone to just drive around you. Absolute fucking chaos. The people are not warm or friendly. They stare and get too close and touch you all the time. I kept having people touch my shoulders and try and touch my face when I was in public or queuing.
I never ever want to return to India ever again. I don’t recommend any of my friends go there. There were very few positives about that trip other than it being an eye opening experience as to how over 1 billion humans on the planet live.
They stare and get too close and touch you all the time. I kept having people touch my shoulders and try and touch my face when I was in public or queuing
This is more of a culture thing, I used to do it a lot when I was younger (it’s considered friendly)
To someone from my culture and to me when I was there, I hated it. It felt the absolute opposite of friendly. It felt predatory. I didn’t feel safe, I felt uncomfortable, I felt I was a freak and an oddity and it made me embarrassed to go anywhere. And this was with Indian-American guides who were familiar with which places to go to and which to avoid for tourists.
I say this to you with no disrespect to you as a person. I’m just trying to state things without sugarcoating them. I appreciate you explaining the cultural perception.
It felt predatory. I didn’t feel safe, I felt uncomfortable, I felt I was a freak and an oddity
I feel no connection to this culture whatsoever, I would happily follow your cultural norms if ever am lucky enough to visit the West, so you are not offending me, and I appreciate the honestly too :)
Train toilets dumping directly on the tracks isn’t excessively unusual, we still have trains here in Austria that do that although it is definitely being phased out.
I grew up in India’s abusive ex (UK). My impression was that people have a
Most people have no problems with Indians and British culture is pretty heavily influenced by India (or at least more so than other countries). Most Brits like Indian food and everyone drinks tea. Vindaloo is especially popular with people who are very drunk, and also happens to be my favourite meal generally (they might ban it in Denmark soon). My experience is that Indians are pretty chill people.
All the news we get from India paints the north as being full of insane zealots/rapists. Stories about whole villages pinning a man down so they can saw off and steal a man’s “holy leg” or young girls getting brutally gang raped etc. I know this probably isn’t the whole story but you need a decent pr team.
Narendra Modi is a twat.
Indians are stereotypically seen as either doctors or corner shop owners. Indians are typically seen as hard working. All tech support and telemarketing is outsourced to India and people don’t typically enjoy those things.
That said the UK does have it’s fair share of racist morons, who will always have a problem with Indians, but that’s because they weren’t raised right.
The caste system and arranged marriage are terrible. It doesn’t strike me as a good place for women.
Wait, they might ban vindaloo in denmark? Why?
I’m joking, Denmark recently banned a variety of instant ramen for being too spicy not joking
This seems ridiculous but a kid in the US died recently after eating a ‘one chip challenge’. He had a heart issue.
People should be able to eat whatever spice level they like. My 5 year old takes bites of my 3x spicy noodles that were banned in Denmark yeah she needs to rinse her mouth, but she enjoys them.
So from the perspective of being in the United States. Remote Indian work it’s cheap but of extremely low quality. This ranges from call center workers to programming and engineering work.
This is usually a sign of the company trying to cheap out and having poor products in general. So it’s kind of a compounding problem.
Politically India seemes racist, nationalist, and terrible on climate change. I’m from the USA so yes I know we are not great on these topics as well.
Having been to India a few times from inside here it’s what I’ve noticed in the country.
The poverty and wealth gap between Indians and westerners means almost everybody wants money from you and to up charge you. From beggars, to chai vendors, to high end stores and hotels. They also love hidden fees and you have to be vigilant about details. This puts me on a constant tense alertness when dealing with people that gets very draining.
I’ve also spent time with an indian family during holy. My western friend was dating a member of the family and we went for a visit. The family was very generous and welcoming. It was the only time in India when I was relaxed and able to chat and enjoy the company.
Racism and classism abound. The ways different ethnic groups treat each other and try to force the use of their language on the other group. For example a Hindi and Malayalam language standoff when I was in Kerala.
Or when at a store that sells stone art has two clearly miserable lower cast people working a human powered cutting tool for the tourists when you can hear the sound of high speed electric tools from the back room.
Animals other then cows are treated horribly. Elephants in particular always looked miserable and broken.
People with government jobs are arrogant and lazy. From customs and immigration to the national parks. I arrived 20 min before closing at a national park to buy tickets for a late night tour that was latter that evening. The ticket both was empty with one other person waiting. Two minutes before closing the guy came to the window in a towel because he had been showing before getting off work.
The belief in crap science abounds. I got an ayurvedic massage that wasn’t a very skilled massage and then the guy tried to give me medical advice. Several people tried to explain that the ayurvedic guys were just as good as doctors. On way out another of the ayurvedic “doctors” tried to sell me a medicine that he assured would remove belly fat and regrow hair. This from a fat bald man.
The fiet time I was in India Modi had just won his first term as Prime Minister while I was there. There was a huge procession of angry young men yelling and pushing people out of the way. I assumed they were from the losing party. My driver informed me that no they had just won the election.
It was clear that this wasn’t a jubilant celebration of success. It was a angry group that now had the power to do what they wanted.
I know i’ve been negative and there is a fair amount of nice things in India but they always are fleeting and overshadowed by something. In the multiple times i’ve been to India i’ve never had a bad meal and there are a lot of nice people. I just think they are constantly at odds with each other.
The most Indian moment I had was drinking tea while enjoying the smell of the spice fields. Then the wind shifted and all I could smell was the stench of shit and diesel from the cesspool over the hill.
I wonder in what ways does India believe they are the world leader of anything? India is just another country America outsources things to. Its way over crowded, weather is insane and the people seem to be stuck in the past in terms of acceptable hygiene and women’s rights.
That being said, i still would love to eat some indian food and witness India’s culture as a tourist.
I wonder in what ways does India believe they are the world leader of anything? India is just another country America outsources things to.
Haha the exact opposite of the comment I posted. America is not the centre of the world.
I wonder in what ways does India believe they are the world leader of anything?
They see the outliers in this system and think that is the norm. i.e., Out of 1.4 billion people, there must be many people who are extremely successful abroad (and are very famous) and Indians think that is the norm and the fact that there are some so many successful people abroad shows that our culture is superior. It really makes sense if you stop thinking about it lol.
And there are some random events happening in such a big country that if you are in an ecosystem of Indian uncles or you haven’t really grown up from metal age of 12, you begin to think the world revolves around us and we are a superpower.
- Massive potential
- Nationalistic
- Somewhat racist
- Unfair caste system
- Not enough bathrooms
- Poverty and hunger
- Extremely rich people
- Excellent food
- Food poisoning
- Nice people
- Misogynistic
- Rich history
- Modi vs INDIA election
- Smart pivot to service sector
- Tata steel
- Lots of languages
- Diverse nature
Going to be a superpower soon if they manage to create a robust middle class and get some nice institutions up and running. India is doing good but it’s hard to manage a country on that scale without being, like, China.
Like any place, there are pros and cons, and since I’ve never visited, I haven’t been exposed to enough to form a proper opinion. However, here are some of my thoughts:
- The culture seems to appreciate intricacy and beauty, with rich colors, complex spicing of food, and gorgeously detailed textiles. Minimalism seems anathema on an aesthetic level.
- The Indians I’ve known have mostly been very warm, kind, patient, pragmatic people.
- There is a worrying divide between the sexes, which IMO is unhealthy and contributes to sexism, sexual assault, and loneliness. I don’t get it because you guys invented the kama sutra!
- I’m not sure why this is, but there seems to be a huge tolerance of unsanitary conditions. We’ve all seen footage of people wading in horribly polluted rivers, or beachfronts covered in trash and human poop, or filthy public bathrooms covered in feces or period blood. Same goes for unsafe conditions - massively overloaded trains, deadly chaotic traffic, etc.
- It seems to me that it must be hard to get ahead in a country with so many people because there’s a massive amount of competition, plus limited opportunities. I think this is why Indians are some of the hardest working people I’ve ever met, and also why some of the Indians I’ve known are willing to undercut the next guy to get ahead.
From afar, I love the food. I’d love to visit and learn more about the country but as a woman I don’t feel safe going there.
India is one of the last places I’d like to visit. This is based on how India has been portrayed in various travel shows over the years (Amazing Race, Top Gear). It looks crowded, dirty, and the locals often aren’t very friendly, especially towards women.
One of your main exports to the west is scam calls. It’s a huge PR problem and your government refuses to address it. Your other main export right now is Russian oil.
Indians used to have a fairly large online presence in English-speaking spaces with mixed results. There were a lot of helpful tech bros on YouTube, but also a lot of horny dudes on Facebook. I don’t really see much of either of those anymore though.
My wife works in software testing and has regular interactions with Indians. Some are really nice, but others are really not. Misogyny is far too common and when Indians are rude they are boldly rude.
One of the largest countries in the world and a hell of a lot of ethnic diversity, so it’s hard to make generalizations. Kerala and, say, UP are very different. But here’s my attempt.
Geopolitically as an entity it’s currently suffering from some of the same things the world’s other largest countries (China, US, Indonesia) are suffering from - namely: populist leaders and a large group of poorly educated people in the population propping them up.
Consequently there is way too much militant nationalism and complacency about aggression towards other nations, territorialism, persecution of certain ethnic minorities, religious fundamentalism. All the biggest countries have those traits at the moment, so it’s not specifically a reflection on India.
In terms of resource and development it’s dealing with a similar situation to other ex colony LICs - years of resource exploitation left it with a low GDP per capita and consequently major challenges when it comes to provision of infrastructure (eg pollution management), health, education, living standards etc.
India has made huge strides in the past but the current wave of populism relies on leveraging social conflict (as it does elsewhere in the eorld) so I think that growth has slowed. For the same reason the fault lines along ethnic, religious, caste lines - which colonialism entrenched or deepened within the region - are still a big aspect.
My personal experiences with Indian people is that just like from anywhere else there are good and bad. Cultured, well educated people are easier to deal with because there is more shared knowledge. Statistically speaking, many of the world’s worst arseholes you are going to meet are going to be from India, China and the US, and that holds up.
I am not sure of assholes. I think they distribute evenly across all nations. On the other side those countries tend to be specifically nationalistic. Russia would also go in this cluster, but it is much more seldom to meet Russians these days in Europe or the US. I just want to add that India has the huge advantage that a lot of people can speak some kind of English. Most with a strong accent, but the percentage of English speaking Indians is very high compared to china, Korea, Japan.
I think arseholes are distributed evenly too.
If 5% of all people are arseholes, everywhere, then a country with 50 million people has 2.5 million arseholes. But a country with 1,428,000,000 people has over 71 million arseholes. This is why they seem to be over represented by the large nations.
You are right that we are more likely to notice them if they travel near us or communicate in a language we understand. This is why Estonians are more likely to think badly of Finns whereas South Africans are more likely to think badly of Nigerians.
I don’t see much about India in the news. I have a friend who worked in a small town for a month during medical school and talks about the poverty and the number of people she saw sleeping on every flat surface in the city.
I work in public education in the US. With Indian families I’ve seen two very different attitudes, which leads me to believe that culturally they either serve others or expect to be served. Most are kind, pleasant, and very appreciative of anything we do for their kids. Others expect us to bend every rule for them- start and end times, attendance, bus times/routes, etc. Our Indian families tend to carry and feed their kiddos longer than others and it seems like little kids (especially boys) ‘rule the roost’ as parents often say things like - he won’t go to bed, won’t stay at the table to eat, won’t get up in the morning, etc. You want to say, “He’s 5. You’re the mom. Set some rules.”
culturally they either serve others or expect to be served
Ohh yes, that’s a nice observation. I have seen people who would just crumble when they encounter someone they perceive to be of a higher class (not caste), but I have also seen people who are “I own this place guys”
It probably talks a lot abt the socio-economic circumstances of their upbringing. Most including me belong to the people who become servile when they encounter authority/class, I am trying to change that tho.
I hate the servility I see around me, people think so less of themselves and way too highly of the corrupt bureaucrat, I have seen what kind of people this culture creates and it’s pretty gloomy!
India gets my respect for its very long history, and the fact it invented buddhism.
But Indian code is terrible. It degrades my respect for the country because it’s just consistently really bad.
A lot of Indian code seems like someone tried to fix a broken car window by caulking a fish tank into place. You confront them and they’re like “What? It’s glass isn’t it? It’s exactly the same”
Now I haven’t seen a lot of Indian code. I’ve seen the output of maybe ten different devs in India, and of that sample it’s all bad. Like really bad.
They work hard and get shit done, but it’s always some kind of hacky kluge made from copy-pasted code.
It’s unclean. It’s full of tech debt. It’s redundant. It’s often not even indented correctly.
Western countries employing Indian coders are generally looking for the cheapest coders they can find who speak passable English. All of that sounds like you got what you paid for.
It’s probably true that the examples I’m thinking of were all from that general notion. The attitude of “We’re going to India to get this done cheap.”
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Yep and when they pay for better they tend to ship the engineer to their base of operations. Huge brain drain.
and the fact it invented buddhism.
Siddhartha was born in what is now Nepal.
I went back and forth thinking you meant code like Building Code, or Traffic Code. But you literally mean programming code.
They work hard and get shit done, but it’s always some kind of hacky kluge made from copy-pasted code.
Honestly, I agree.
I will argue that the only code I ever saw from India was from coding firms hired by American companies thinking they can save a few bucks. But then people like me are paid 10x more to fix it.
That code seems to lack any sort of creative thinking or big picture. It’s loops within loops. It’s using stuff like letters for variables, or abbreviations. It’s duplicating code in 3000 line files.
At first, I thought it was just laziness or trying to get it done asap. But then I felt sad when I gave them a lot of feedback, got the changes back, then the next set of code, saw the same issues over again. Like they really don’t see a problem with this.
Unfortunately this is my experience as well. It’s probably something in the way that it’s taught over there? I do love my Indian coworkers-- they’re nice and willing to help or collaborate, and are good people as far as I can tell-- but some of the architectural decisions are something that I can only describe as baffling.
On India itself, its impressive that it’s the world’s largest democracy. Indians are well educated relative to similarly poor countries and have high English literacy, which is why many believe it could outpace China.
I admire their charitibility. My local area has a large Indian population as I live near a large hindu temples in the US. There is always cheap, high quality food for those in need (1$ for a large plate of food). The kitchen is operated by volunteers and rely on donations and food banks. I Believe this is also common practice in many temples within India proper.
There are plenty of unsavory things such as the caste system but overall harbor a lot of respect for the country and people.
The kitchen is operated by volunteers and rely on donations and food banks. I Believe this is also common practice in many temples within India proper.
Here’s a great little mini-documentary on that I saw on exactly that a few months back. Sikh temples seem amazing in terms of the sheer numbers of people they feed with no limiting criteria.
Fantastic food. Entirely too rapey.
At a risk of downvote oblivion, this is what comes to mind to me. Keep in mind that this is just what I perceive about India through all the media I’ve consumed so it can come across as a bit prejudiced. I’m sure there’s more nuance.
The good:
- Amazing food, rich culture
- Seemingly big into tech.
- Very colorful.
- People seem generally friendly.
The bad:
- So. Insanely. Chaotic.
- Basic sanitation and infrastructure seem stuck a few decades ago.
- Female emancipation is lacking as far as I can gather.
- A lot of inequality in general.
- The weather seems like hell to me.
- Even though they’re big into tech, it comes across to me that the government and general population is still stuck in the mid 90’s regarding devices (pc’s etc, smartphones excluded).
I feel combining this with @PerogiBoi@lemmy.ca likely creates a fairly accurate sense for the place.
India is, well…despite their historical advances in medicine and continued strong cultural fascination with academia, at some point they became nothing but call centers, distribution points, and scam centers. There is certainly more to India, though when I think of hacking, I think of China and Russia. When I think of scams, unfortunately India is top of the list.
Even though they’re big into tech, it comes across to me that the government and general population is still stuck in the mid 90’s regarding devices (pc’s etc, smartphones excluded).
India is big in software. Hardware has to be imported from China / Korea / Taiwan, and we have to pay them what they demand.
I wouldn’t view India as a world leader in any field but may be ignorant of some specialities? I know there is innovation but nothing major springs to mind. I’m being lazy though - that can likely be looked up and verified with stats.
Technology wise, it appears to depend on western countries outsourcing work, which isn’t necessarily a bad thing but isn’t a good thing either since the draw to using India isn’t skill but cost. If the cost goes up, the west will stop outsourcing there and go to some other low cost base. (I’m not saying Indians aren’t skilled, just that’s not the primary reason why outsourcing there is happening, it’s all about exploitation from the west in search of more profit).
Politically it seems to have been a dumpster fire for some time and looks like it’s trending towards more national extremism. Though that doesn’t seem to be unique at all - feels like the world is shifting to more fascist tendencies.
The caste system is especially cruel and I regularly read stories that it’s going strong with no signs of stopping. I find that morally repugnant.
The amount of scams against innocent people that originate from India is shocking, and it really appears as though corruption is so high that it’s not going to get better any time soon.
Professionally, I deal with Indians semi regularly and it’s overall positive. Personally, I’ve come across a few assholes but the majority have been decent people and none of the issues above ever come up.
I know there is innovation but nothing major springs to mind
There is NO INNOVATION. There are no discoveries happening here. R&D budget and the budget for education is peanuts, there isn’t much innovation happening in India and the innovation that does happen, happens in handful of universities by students who could not afford to move out to a better country which would fund their research.
